I was going to make this topic a couple hours ago, but went to dinner…>> <<…anyway, ya I’m a little upset by this as well. This and the change in batteries.
The new one weighs too much for my taste.
Pavan.
I really like the smart panels, you can get feedback, and make stuff work better with those, but from what i have been hearing, companies that have been donating components to FIRST have been complaining that teams haven’t been using what they were donating. so instead of designing their components to be more team/weight friendly, they make the components that teams are using illegal. I really don’t know who decided on that change, but if you read this, please feel free to contact me directly, i have some questions for you.
-Yoda
I don’t really understand your post…But from what I do understand your saying that companies who are donation parts are designing them so it is illeagle to use them? It doesn’t make any sense.
A clearer post would help
I believe Yoda88 is saying that teams who have been donating parts aren’t happy with how little their parts are being used; people have been turning to other companies instead. Rather than improving their donated products to be more appealing, FIRST has just changed the rules so that the other parts are not allowed.
Just to be clear, this is what I believe Yoda88 is saying, and is by no means necessarily what I believe myself.
Wish they were letting us use the IFI panels… this other stuff is so kludgy. The IFI panel is so much lighter, more compact, and everything is centralized.
Maybe we can expect an update in a few weeks allowing us to use it - much like last season. Atleast one could only hope. I took a look at the new ones and i’m not a fan of them. We’ve used the Smart Panel for the past 2 seasons. Personally, I don’t think the way to get more teams to use stuff thats donated is going to be accomplished by making all other parts illegal. I’m reminded of the new batteries right about now…hmm…
<sarcasm>
We could always revolt… 
</sarcasm>
No, I agree with FIRST if they decided against IFI breaker panels because the sponsors complained. FIRST only exists because of sponsors, and it would be horrible for FIRST to lose sponsors.
IFI’s site says out of stock for the entire year.
Yep, no awesome panels this year. Major crapfest, but I guess it’s not that big of a deal. Just another curveball. Seems like we’re getting alot of those this year…
Those breakers were nice, but just think now FIRST is forcing us to be simpler.
Agreed. I’ll miss that IFI panel … made teaching students the electrical system so much easier.
But that new AB terminal block is kind of cool … I will admit that.
what i’m saying is that companies like Rockwell Automation have been complaining that FIRST teams haven’t been using the terminal blocks and other components that Rockwell has donated.
My feeling is that if somebody wants to donate something, that’s terrific, but if it really isn’t that good and people would rather use other parts available on the market they should be able to - rather than being force-fed all of the donated parts. I’m bummed.
I think FIRST wants us to use the parts that the sponsors give to kind of give those companies importance. If no one used those new panels this year than the company would feel as if it was a waste on their part of donating it. I think at the same time I think that the product has to be good. In this case the “klunky” panel is heavy and is less “capable” in my opinion comared the the smartpanel.
FIRST made a BIGGG mistake in my opinion and I hope they retract that rule at least this year and tell the company that supplied them that although the contribution is appreciated, it is not too practical
Pavan.
I’ll venture another explanation: maybe FIRST wants to expose a future generation of engineers to more standard methods of interconnecting and protecting power circuits when the wiring is field accessible. While I agree with those who say the 2005 IFI breaker panel is very convenient and compact*, I wonder if it meets the same safety standards as the components that are required for 2007?
*and, BTW, easier to inspect.
Has anyone considered the possibility that this decision came from IFI? Perhaps they were not selling enough of these panels or for some other reason were no longer interested in producing them and told FIRST that they didn’t intend to sell them this year. If this was the case, then FIRST may have chosen to disallow them simply because it wouldn’t be fair to the new teams who would not be able to purchase this from IFI.
I have no information to suggest that this is what happened or anything, but I’m just pointing out that FIRST’s hand could have been forced on this one.
That is what I thought at the beginning too and so I e-mailed IFI and am waiting until Monday to get a response.
Pavan.
I, too, am bummed about the Panels. We are a rookie team this year, though I have been involved with FIRST for several now, and I must say, these Panels were VERY convenient, in in my opinion, safer.
I do hope that FIRST allows us to use the Panels.
Jacob Komar
FIRST electronics rules have always emphasized safety and simplicity of inspection over what some consider ideal. Whatever your opinion, that’s the way it is, just like the rules limiting any other aspect of the game.
I don’t beleive that the smart panels are available anymore, so it’s not fair for teams who have them from previous years to use them when others can’t. I think they were donated by Innovation FIRST, custom made for us, like many of their products. IFI continues to donate lots of parts to us some of them much more exotic than the compact, intelligent panel. Given the choice, I’ll take the newer stuff from IFI and be happy rather than complain that they can’t do the same thing they did two years ago.
The new distribution terminal strip seems like a huge improvement to the heavy blocks we were given in some previous years. The parts are also reliable, standard components that the Rockwell Automation (Allen Bradley is part of Rockwell) can supply in the huge numbers required as the program grows.
For what it’s worth, I talked with a representative of RA (one of the most dedicated FIRST volunteers I know) about this issue last spring. I also asked on these forums and other teams about what they would like to see RA donate to the kit of parts. As I understand it, this looks like a win-win: FIRST needed a reliable, safe, and available electrical distribution system, Rockwell wanted to support the program by donating useful items directly to teams.