# Starting configuration in the Goalie Zone

Hello, I have a question about the starting configuration in the goalie zone.
Are we allowed to start with an arm that is about 8 ft high at the start of the match? Can you cite the rule please?
Thanks!

Just for a little exercise, can you cite a rule saying you CANâ€™T start 8â€™ tall in the goalie zone?

HINT #1
Here is part of the answer:

3.2.5.6 G23
If a ROBOT is in contact with carpet in its GOALIE ZONE, and for only one ROBOT per ALLIANCE at a time, â€¦

But donâ€™t just look at the one place in the rules. Remember many places in the rules cover the robot and what can and canâ€™t be done.

Hint #2
There is another part of the rules that mentions â€śSTARTING CONFIGURATIONâ€ť

Happy Hunting.

There is nothing in the rules that gives a maximum height for the starting configuration. We talked about this at OKC and allowed a robot starting in the goalie zone to have an unlimited height. We had Frank Merick there too, so Iâ€™m guessing if that wasnâ€™t allowed, he would have said something.

Hint #2

4.1.4 R4
In the STARTING CONFIGURATION, the ROBOT must constrain itself such that no part of the ROBOT extends
outside the vertical projection of the FRAME PERIMETER, with the exception of minor protrusions such as bolt heads,
fastener ends, rivets, etc.

Nowhere does it state a horizontal limit.

I went back and re-read the rules and the glossary for STARTING CONFIGURATION and I think your interpretation at OKC was correct. I didnâ€™t catch that one.

Iâ€™m guessing you meant to say vertical instead of horizontal.

It states the horizontal limit right there. â€śno part of the robot extends outside the vertical projection of the frame perimeter.â€ť That means the imaginary vertical wall that is 20" from your frame. There is no rule however stating that vertical height limits are any different in starting configuration than they are during tele-op.

The frame perimeter is the imaginary vertical plane defined by the outside face of the frame.

The 20" distance you mentioned has to do with the restriction during the match, not the starting configuration.

You do know there is a ceiling? Would that be considered contact outside of the field?

You can extend as high as you want, as shown by our static 8 ft robot . But the biggest problems we came into were doors and loading onto the field.

Whoops, I didnâ€™t mean to put in the 20", I was just referring to frame perimeter limits.

Looks like you can have an 8â€™ robot. Just be careful to always be in contact with the goalie zone.

In theory an opponent can push you out of the goalie zone. I would not call that a G14 violation because the purpose of pushing you out is to get you to drop to 5â€™ to make their shots easier. Just because your robot is incapable of dropping below 5â€™ is not their problem.

Another question as per the rules, can a Goalie robot be pre-placed anywhere in the goalie zone or does it need to start centered and move itself to defend the goal after autonomous starts?

It may be placed anywhere, but you have to declare a final position, after which offensive (non-goalie zone) bots get to pick positions.

Ok thanks.

And just to cite a rule:

Which was later clarified in the Q&A to be like I stated (goalies must place first, then white-zone bots may (re-)position)

We actually had an issue with that in L.A.â€“one of the teams was playing goalie, but they positioned, their opponents positioned, then the goalie team repositioned, and then their opponents repositionedâ€¦ After a couple of rounds of that, one of the refs went over and kept them from moving the robot again.

Basically, once youâ€™ve placed, your opponents can adjustâ€“but if you adjust again, so can they. Do it too often, and get called for delaying the match.

They made us change after initial practice rounds, we now have to automate movement during autonomous rather than just being a static blocker pre-placed.

Sorry, but there is nothing in the rules that says that you have to MOVEâ€“in any way, shape, or formâ€“during automode. You can, in fact, just sit there, regardless of where you are on the fieldâ€“itâ€™s called the Mars Rock automode (you sit there and wait for Opportunity to come along). Whoever made you change that can go read the rulebook againâ€“standard penalty for not knowinâ€™ the rules.