For those team members impacted by the UIL change I can offer this:3999 is open to anyone. We have a student that travels over 50 miles each way to be a part of our team. Skype is very effective in allowing our remote team members to participate. If you want to participate you find a way to make it work. I would have liked to sit down with some of those who made this decision but it didnt happen. Maybe it will happen in the future. Our team is structured differently than most. This was our choice. If we get excluded from certain events then so be it.
Norman… doesn’t ALL the money go to FIRST-in-Texas when they convert to DISTRICT MODEL? Team registration fees and Texas sponsor dollars ALL go to FiT when District Model?
And then FiT pays an annual fee to USFIRST, similar to a franchise fee?
–Michael Blake
THAT’S the best post on this whole thread.
You guys are an awesome team.
–Michael Blake
BAZINGA.
But, they’re saying only for this year TRR and I believe them.
–Michael Blake
All money paid by a first team for registration passes along to FIRST HQ. It does not stay with FiT. I do not understand how that benefits FiT.
Districts are handled differently by different districts.
Here is how PNW is handling it, they are the first to pioneer this model.
http://www.firstwa.org/Programs/FIRST-Robotics-Competition/Payment-Details/FRC-Funding
And for a look into the FiM system I highly recommend everyone read this document.
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/media/papers/2804
Norman… I asked when we convert to DISTRICT MODEL… which should happen next season or the next after that at the latest, doesn’t ALL the money from the FRC team registration fees and Texas FRC sponsors get paid to and remain with FIRST-in-Texas to operate itself and the competitions minus an annual fee FiT pays to USFIRST as a “franchise/license” fee?
I could be wrong on this, but I’m going on what I’ve been told by those who should know…
–Michael Blake
In most district models, the $5000 registration fees by teams goes straight to FIRST HQ. $1000/team is then regranted from FIRST HQ back to the district organization.
PNW pioneered a new funding model this past year for several reasons, but even in the PNW model, the same amount of money is sent to FIRST HQ. What you are suggesting sounds similar to the PNW model, and it is possible that FiT is trying to adopt this funding model right away. More information about this model can be found here: http://pnwfirst.org/wp/files/Funding-FIRST-in-the-Northwest.pdf
When someone (in or out of state) wants to play an addition district event, that $1000 registration fee goes directly towards the district organization.
It’s probably still baking on what the financial model will end up as in Texas but I can only go on what I’ve been told by USFIRST and FIRST-in-Texas folks that actually have business cards with “FIRST” on it.
I do know for a fact, and I have the pricing sheet, that there’s a new effort afoot to raise BIG TIME $$ from Texas corporate and large organizations where the checks go to FIRST-in-Texas and this effort is to lay the financial runway to convert to District Model.
ALL good stuff, but is evidence that the financial “checkbook” for Texas FRC (at least) is moving away from USFIRST to FIRST-in-Texas where I’ve been told FiT’s revenue goals are in the millions of dollars annually.
–Michael Blake
Can someone from FIRST-in-Texas chime-in and inform the teams on the targeted financial model FiT intends to operate under when converted to DISTRICT MODEL?
Who are the team registration fees paid to?
How are the team registration fees shared, if they are?
Who are the Texas and regional sponsors $$ paid to?
How are the Texas and regional sponsors $$ shared, if they are?
SUNSHINE is always the best policy in operating a nonprofit public benefit corporation which USFIRST and FIRST-in-Texas are.
–Michael Blake
ALWAYS… and I mean always follow the money --and-- observe people’s actions and inaction’s.
Words are almost always “noise” to what’s really happening… 58 years of life lessons have informed me that this is the truth.
Good people, good intentions, doesn’t always produce the best, most effective, outcomes… but, sometimes it does and maybe this is one time it will but we’ll see.
Waiting for some info on the above questions in the box… 
–Michael Blake
@ https://www.maketecheasier.com/manage-touchpad-avoid-typing-errors/ 
If it will take longer than 10 hours this is another 10 hour parody for you ::rtm::
The views & expressions listed is solely my own and no reflection of my team(s), program or district. :eek: That being said.
I coach FTC in the middle of nowhere(150miles to a large city). We only take students that are part of the school system due to district policy. I agree that the way this seems to have rolled out with some lack of communication, can and will stir up issues and bring things into light maybe people didn’t think of when deciding to implement. No one has addressed several issues that the forum has brought forth. They, FiT, have implemented an FAQ section on FIT. So there is progress and being proactive in the issues.
The concern with the UIL is the teams are not being able to participate. It is a double edge sword. FIRST to me has always invited all to play, all are welcomed. This is UIL “borrowing” TRR for a year and most likely wanting to steal some thunder from FIRST. I feel UIL wants to join the bandwagon and slap their name on the program. So they can say they have a new program and FiT gets more teams involved during the normal season as a by-product which in turns more funds.
From my viewpoint, UIL will not affect the normal FRC/FTC season. It is just adding another layer to compete in during the year for some teams.
Not UIL school you can’t go. Do not like the idea of UIL not letting a team play, then do not go, your teams call. I think it can be used as a tool to spin your own view. I think FiT & FIRST need to address the “partnership”. For some of us, it feels like a hostile take over. Several of us have a bad taste when you mention UIL.
No one as well has mentioned if FTC will only be allowed 1 team per school. That is the normal allowances in UIL. I have 4 teams here and I know most larger schools have 3-6 teams. What about multiple schools that feed one team. It gets muddy quickly. I know FRC that is not an issue.
I do agree about the money issue(s) as it relates. I have been given some information when I questioned why 20% of the FRC world population went to worlds and only 2% of the FTC went to worlds.
I was told point blank that it’s about money. When you factor the costs of team registrations and other fees, FRC generates upwards of 22+ million vs. 1.25 million. I was told they would have to raise the costs for FTC to register to 1000$ per team and invite a crazy amount of teams to worlds to compare.
IMO, this can be seen as non-profit to profit or it takes a lot of money to run the program. I understand we all have been in a situation where we needed to look for new money streams to help our program. I assume and hope this is what Fit & FIRST had in mind.
I love FIRST! 
It is my family and families do not always see eye to eye on things. I do,however, have a major issue when the core values can get side swiped and we start down a dark path that the mission is no longer the voice of FIRST.
Just curious, was there every a vote or poll on this move to include UIL or how did that occur?
J. Reed
Robotics coach 2008 - present
John… there was neither and the process and progress was super opaque and vague to those outside of the FiT club.
Believe me, I tried to get in there–they’re an insular group, all good and good intentioned people, but if you’re not in their circle you have no chance to contribute and affect anything.
I understand the approach, because the leadership has their agenda and goals (which BTW is publicly stated where?!), but it hacks me off that there aren’t enough, if any, experienced, rubber hits the road, current Texas adult FIRST team leaders on the FIRST-in-Texas Board of Directors to represent the “real” of what’s needed in Texas competition robotics.
–Michael Blake
John… very mostly true… but there are teams, like mine, where the future composition of the team is affected by this.
We have always been a mixed-bag of public/private/home school students–we recruit public school students from our district… the private/home school students just find us and ask to join.
Going forward, we’re instructed to be UIL compliant and no more private/home school students.
That’s a BIG affect on this team and on my plans I had for the team… plus the affect on the future private/home students I haven’t even met yet that I’ll now have to turn away–which I can tell you will kill my soul a little bit each time I have to do that.
–Michael Blake
[quote=a
]
I don’t think this will happen at all. It is not like being a UIL recognized event opens up purse strings that weren’t open before. I have already been told by my UIL coordinator that there are no, and will not ever be, additional funds for robotics in the UIL budget.
As for letter jackets. My school gets those for my kids now even though we are not UIL. That is a school by school decision.[/quote]
As a fellow FTC sponsor, I mirror your concerns. I have sent an e-mail to the UIL STEM rep overseeing the robotics pilot asking about the one school, one team aspect. IF I ever get an answer, I will be sure to post it here.
With respect, I think you underestimate the leverage, being a UIL sport, brings to local teams. It is already happening at our school. Informed that the Dallas competition was used to calculate points for the UIL State Championship we got transportation and other things paid by the school.
Principals prioritize UIL sports and clubs. All UIL activities contribute points to the sponsoring school. A successful robotics program might be pulled under the UIL blanket quickly - more “points”, more prestige. Of course a principal or a team might chose to be non-UIL, even at a UIL eligible school. That is true of any sport or club.
After three very aggressively toned posts to this effect, let’s take a bigger look at your claim.
Are private schools included in other UIL events? In those cases, are all private schools invited or is it a subset of the private schools?
When we realize UIL events tend to include UIL teams, it shouldn’t be angering to see that being consistent. It’s not creating tiers. It’s creating more opportunities for some kids.
It’s more surprising you’d naturally expect UIL to open up their competition to all schools. If UIL membership isn’t required, it’s no more of a stretch to ask why schools near Texas borders aren’t invited. We could just as easily be upset the event excludes LA schools. Students are students, aren’t they?
Is it perfect? Not at all. But, there’s no need to be THIS upset about it.
For some districts it almost assuredly will. For our district it’s written into the board rules that if you qualify for the State level of a UIL competiton, that the school board helps fund travel (I forget the specifics without looking it up). In fact I think there may have been some kerfuffle about it because ____ goes directly to states without any regional/district competition and there were arguments that they shouldn’t be funding their travel since they don’t have to qualify prior. Again, that’s specific to our district but I’d be surprised if we were the only one.
As far as letterman jackets go, you’re correct - it’s definitely a school to school decision. But if it’s a UIL recognized thing - I’d be surprised if any team would be rejected being allowed to letter in robotics. Right now, we’re told no lettering - but I’m hoping with UIL that’ll change for our kids that really want to letter in Robotics.