Tipping over.

While watching at VCU I noticed many many bots falling over. At least 1 every couple of matches. There was even one match where I believe 3 bots tipped over (it was either a qf or sf match and the only bot I remember was 116 I believe).

This is my first year, so my question is: In previous year, was it common for bots to tip over? Also would tipping an opponent bot over be a legal strategy? (not very nice, but doesn’t break any rules as far as I can see)

<G32> Strategies aimed solely at the destruction, damage, tipping over or entanglement of robots are not in the spirit of the FIRST Robotics Competition and are not allowed. Accidental tipping over of a robot is not considered damaging and may be allowed at the discretion of the referees. Intentional stabbing, cutting, etc., is illegal. If a breach of this rule occurs, the team will be disqualified for that match. Repeated offenses could result in a team being disqualified from the remainder of the regional competition and/or championship event.

And yes in the past few years is has not been uncommon for robots to fall over. Especially last year.

It mainly depends on the calibur and foresight of the given team…a ten foot high bar requires a ten foot long arm to reach it…that, for all you science buffs out there, will make your center of gravity very very very high…causing tips…the one twist that has really caught this years challenge is the steps…wheels up steps is not the greatest combination in the world…this causes many of the falls that you saw…its not uncommon for a robot to flip…however i think that the nature of this years game tends to attract such falls

From section 7:

**[left]<T04> Robots may not intentionally:[/left]
[left]
• Detach Parts (no connection at all to a robot);
[/left]
[left]
• Damage another robot;
[/left]
[left]• Tip over another robot;[/left]
[left]• Attach themselves to the vertical supports of the pull-up bar system;[/left]
[left]*• Attach themselves to the railings/walls of any field structure.[/left]
*:slight_smile:

Aidan

Wow guess I really missed those, lol. Were those in subsequent updates or the base rules?

I know that many bots flipped over last year…just look at Wildstang’s teaser! If you hit someone with their huge arm at full up, and they fall over, that is legal as far as I know. FIRST doesn’t want people with pneumatically actuated plates to “spatulate” robots, and other things like that.

I know that two of the three matches we lost the whole time at VCU were due to flipped alliances. One was the last match in seeding, which caused us to loose the #1 seed. The other was in the second match of the finals, which set the stage for a great third match!

wildstang did have a problem with tipping over on the teaser video… but they fixed it… they added some kind of bumper in the front and back to balance the robot from tipping over… (you can also see it on the teaser video)…

Bot tipping over is nothing new… no matter what you would atleast see one robot tip over…

No, I mean the footage from last year (tipping others).

Tipping often is caused by bad driving. Know the constraint of your design and you can find out what you can and can’t do.

Here is a good example in the real world:

http://marsrovers.jpl.nasa.gov/gallery/video/movies/mer_ch_cruise_testing.mov

It really cool too!!

sorry about that paul…

I think most of the reason there’s been a lot of tipping the last couple years (bear with me I’m a sophomore…clueless on before that) is because of the uneven playing field. When you’re higher than another part…you can always fall over and then be laying on your back…same on a ramp, if you’re pushing another bot, and they happen to have sloped sides…up…and back.
There’s always those things about high CG… driving… how you move an arm… such things that can make the robot tip over.
Best to just be careful and hope for good luck :slight_smile:

Ellen

Prettymuch all games had a danger element to them when it came to tipping over. This year has the stairs and bar, last year was the “hill”, 2001 had the teeter-totter and the 4x4 in the middle, 2000 had the ramp and bar, 1999 had the puck and raising your catch 8 feet, 1998 you had to raise up pretty high to deposit a ball on the 3-point rung, 1997 had the putting an inner tube on top of the spinning goal being a tipping hazard, 1995 had the ramp, 1994 had the tower. Plus, up through 1997, it was perfectly legal to tip an opponent. Really, barring a robot ramming into you with your CoG too high, the only game that had no tipping danger was 2002 (and I suppose 1992 & 1993 when the robots were too small). So yeah, tipping over is prettymuch expected in a FIRST game. The challenge is avoiding it.

I think with the hole tipping over issue can be solved for many team by just shifting the battery , well for us it helps and for most it might do the same.

Hey give it a try and see what happens. Good luck…

D@VE

At VCU, our robot started to go up the steps and started to drive right up the pvc goal posts to fil over. In past matches the posts only diverted the robot around the goal. The differance was we had added a high friction surface (a poped 2x ball) to the arm.

I think one of the major advantages of some teams was the ability to right themselves. our robot for instance couldn’t do anything on its back. I did see, however, several good robots that could use their arms to corect their poistion.

In the final match of the NH finals I accidentally tiped over team 40’s robot and i still feal bad about it. So to team 40 i apologize if any damage was done i was just trying to keep you from hooking.

So no hard feelings? :wink:

-Tom

don’t feel that bad, last year i accidentally tipped one of our alliance partners. yikes!