What will teams average?

That’s only if you take the entire 2:15 to score the 6 cargo. (Which leaves no time for the climb.) If you take out the last 30s for the climb, that ends up being about 17s cycles. (Which still isn’t awful)

No, that was excluding the endgame 30 seconds. 35 seconds/cycle x 3 = 105 seconds = 1:45 minutes. That all assumes, of course, that you’re doing a 2 cargo cycle each time. 17 seconds would be the scoring time per individual cargo, which is indeed a lot of time. Usually, I’ve seen cycle time expressed as the time to collect and score a full set of game objects that the robot is allowed to carry.


I think we’ll all find that the distance is going to be pretty far.

If we see your game piece nearby, you can expect us at the very least to bump it away from the HUB if we don’t pick it up and throw it away.

Since the HUB is so large this may be a more viable defense strat over pushing other bots.
Pretty bad view if you have to collect balls from the other end.


Hence the need for speed…the balls usually aren’t where the robot that needs them is, it’s pretty common to have to zip across the field.

I love these day 3 gameplay predictions :slight_smile:

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I think 10-12 for elite is low. I expect “elite teams” to be able to complete the ball RP solo (5 ball auto, 13 ball teleop; or 4 ball auto, 16 ball teleop). The 5 ball auto version of this is more likely since it reduces the amount of balls needed in teleop, which for these teams will be especially important when they are being defended (elite teams are likely to be defended more often).


Pro tip, powder coat your robot bright yellow. Attracts defense :wink:

(stares intensely at Curie 2019)


Painting your robot
Pro: Teams remember you as that insert color robot during alliance selection
Con: Defense flocks towards paint

Avg: 2 balls
Good: 4 balls
Elite: 10 balls

I think people are dramatically underestimating how hard cycles will be this year.

  • Game pieces will be in completely unknown locations on the field, making it significantly harder to practice for
  • Balls will be constantly moving/bouncing from:
    • Coming out of the goal
    • Teams shooting and missing
    • Teams intentionally shooting the opponent balls in random directions
  • It will be a super defense heavy game:
    • The only safe zone on the field is very far back from the goal
    • Teams can pick up all balls they see and shoot it at the goal or away from it based on the color, for turreted robots this is even easier
    • Combination of the above two means for the first time it’s feasible that all 3 robots on an alliance play defense in some form or another
  • The vast majority of teams will never practice under any realistic conditions:
    • 6 robots, 22 balls, balls bouncing everywhere and congestion on the field are totally different from a single robot lining up to shoot
    • With omicron many teams will find it even harder to meet/practice
  • It’s one of the most driver/coach skill dependent games ever, similar to 2014 but with a more complex game

There will be some very high scoring matches from elite teams, but I don’t see teams maintaining high averages


Our Monte Carlo Analysis of the game is going up tonight! Stay tuned for our assessment.


Also literally just robots running into these balls.

Your profile says your rookie year was 2014 what were the two robots not currently holding the ball doing at your competitions that year? In my experience 2014 was the year were everyone from a rookie KOP chasis to 254 played defense at some point in almost every match.

I am going to assume these all were only assuming Teleop and not auto as it is highly likely elite teams will be doing 4-6 scored in auto.

So in 2019 to do a rocket solo was 10 cycles of 1 game piece minimum (assuming a 2 hatch auto), a lot of the time under defense in a very small area while precisely placing something held on only by velcro. Elite teams were dealing with this exact situation a lot while most also could not pick up said velco-game piece if it was dropped infront of them.

Do you really think that collecting and scoring cargo is twice as hard as completing a rocket under defense? Because right now if left to their own devices I think the number is close to double that, and under defense will still be more than 12.

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Most teams do not need to go faster than 10fps because most teams don’t have the practice space to accommodate the extra speed. Why build it if you can’t practice with it?


I’ll give our students more credit than that…they’re fast learners

Painting your robot blue and red polka dots
Pro: Memorable look
Con: Defense & cargo seeking bots flock towards it


Average: 2 high goal balls per match
Good: 0 high goal balls per match
Elite: 8 high goal balls per match

As for gearing around 10 FPS - lots of very short distances to travel, quick direction changes, and fine adjustment. Not a whole ton of full field cycles to worry about…


Did you mean to put zero for good teams, or do you think above average and below elite teams should focus on lower hub scoring?

I think an elite team should be going for a 5 ball auto. It seems fairly achievable.

The biggest question would be who makes the fifth shot, the robot or HP. If it is the robot you have to be making 3 shots from the terminal which definitely is a challenge. It may be more sense to snag the fourth cargo and come closer and let the 5th make come from the HP throw.

I believe that the average team will not focus on scoring in the lower hub and will be a relatively ineffective high goal shooter. I believe some very good teams will be low goal specialists and will straight up outscore 90% of teams that way.

I’m not active on a team this year so my analysis isn’t that much more rigorous than just reading the manual, but this seems like one of the best low goal games we’ve had in a long time.


I agree with this. At the very least that it’s has a closer margin that other years for points. I second the belief that many teams with shoot high with low success. I think the best approach will be those whom can effectively get the low goal while they tune in a high goal shot.

For drive speed…how many teams are going to go large on their FPS and never reach it? Many is my guess. Spending the time to understand drivetrain kinematics is an art that I’ve only recently come to appreciate.

Ok, I agree with that. My team has nearly exclusively been thinking low hub since kickoff with a high (3rd) rung climber. And, like you said, I think a simple, well thought out low hub scorer with a bit of practice will be able to score a lot of points.

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